Grub Live vs toram?

Hello Kicksecure,

Been a long time lurker since I started using whonix and really like debian and all that jazz.

So my question is whats the difference between grub live and a custom grub entry with toram noswap nohibernate flags?

Whats different with “grub live” or makes it different from a custom entry that has toram noswap nohibernate chosen and passed after selecting it in the bootloader?

Previously I installed grub-live on debian through the Kicksecure repo in the past out of curiosity it said I had swap enabled still which also confuses it me? That was like many months ago so I’m sure things have changed?

Is it some kind of compression swap like overlay like zram?

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grub-live mode mounts the root filesystem read-only, and uses one or more writable tmpfs filesystems (which exist purely in RAM) to store file changes. On the other hand, toram copies an ISO live filesystem into RAM entirely, so that you don’t need the boot media plugged in anymore for the system to remain running.

(Note that toram appears to be specific to live-tools and initramfs-tools. Kicksecure uses Dracut for initramfs management; the corresponding feature in Dracut appears to be rd.live.ram=1. I wouldn’t expect this to work with an installed Kicksecure system, but it might work on the ISO. Untested.)

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That’s how initramfs-tools calls it.

Kicksecure nowadays uses dracut as initrd generator. So that’s not applicable.

grub-live no longer supports initramfs-tools a this time (and doesn’t look as if we’re getting that back either).

You can look up what these options do in Debian man pages. → Utilize Search Engines, Documentation and AI

I don’t remember such a bug. swap-file-creator always disabled itself once live mode was detected but maybe that message was confusing.

Please post log output or a screenshot should that still be an issue.

There’s extensive documentation what grub-live actually does. Both, as user documentation and also a technical summary for developers.


nohibernate: grub-live uses that too.

  • toram: Is probably the same as rd.live.ram=1.

See also:
Load Kicksecure into RAM - #2 by Patrick

Thank you both for your replies

Note that toram appears to be specific to live-tools and initramfs-tools. Kicksecure uses Dracut for initramfs management; the corresponding feature in Dracut appears to be rd.live.ram=1. I wouldn’t expect this to work with an installed Kicksecure system, but it might work on the ISO.

Is rd.live.ram= depreciated or changed? What branch is dracut sourced from? Is it from testing I’d assume right?

Please post log output or a screenshot should that still be an issue.

It was an old install so no longer have logs…looking to flash a new ISO

Has Kicksecure fully transitioned to dracut as its initramfs generator? Is Kicksecure the first debian based distro that uses dracut? Looks like Fedora/RHEL has used it for awhile, which is not debian though.

After digging I see Ubuntu is switching to Dracut following 25.10 release.

Not that I’m aware of. Kicksecure doesn’t use it in our packages, and I doubt it would work on a fully installed system since it likely wants to copy a live image into RAM, not an installed partition. If you want to try using it with the ISO (or in other contexts), you’re welcome to; the 90dmsquash-live module in Kicksecure’s version of dracut seems to have the ability to parse rd.live.ram, so I assume it’s supported.

Kicksecure is using the same version of Dracut that’s in Debian Trixie. Right now that’s version 106-6 (so upstream version 106, Debian revision 6). We’ll probably stick with that for the duration of Kicksecure 18’s support.

We have indeed. We were using it as our primary initramfs generator in Kicksecure 17, but had initramfs-tools support as a fallback. In Kicksecure 18 we dropped the initramfs-tools support and are relying solely on Dracut.

Not sure. We’ve been using it longer than Ubuntu, but not sure if we’re the first. It works for us and our users, that’s what we care about mainly.

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The primary motivation for porting to dracut was ram-wipe - Wipe RAM on shutdown and reboot.

More history: replacing initramfs-tools with dracut - Development - Whonix Forum